koi pox update?

[rubyduby]

Just wondering how your koi are doing Brokensword?

[brokensword]

Just wondering how your koi are doing Brokensword?

well, I quarantined a fish with the pox, raised the temp up past 70, and it all went away in a week. So, the research was correct. Since the weather got warm again, I figured I'd put it back in the pond for the winter and monitor. So far, looks okay and this is with water at 57F. I expect the pox to come back but it doesn't seem fatal. I've read conflicting info re whether it's contagious (this is my belief). There's still probably 5 or so that also have some form of the pox, some more, some less. I'm hoping the water warms early next spring and it all goes away, but we'll see.

Now, there were a couple more that had ulcers/wounds. From what, I'm not sure. One hasn't changed (my ochiba sigure), another has seen it's bruise get smaller (my gin matsuba), and two others are in a holding pattern too. I've not seen either the turtles or other fish go after the koi and these 'ulcers/wounds' seem to only be on the koi; it might be from spawning behavior but I didn't see any evidence (among the koi) this year, and I look via the pondcam all the time.

So in a nutshell; no more losses, koi pox looks to be here to stay with it receding when the water warms, and those with ulcer/wounds will be entering winter that way. Guess I'll see when spring arrives as to if any of this cost any fish lives.

[j.w]

Just wondering how your koi are doing Brokensword?

well, I quarantined a fish with the pox, raised the temp up past 70, and it all went away in a week. So, the research was correct. Since the weather got warm again, I figured I'd put it back in the pond for the winter and monitor. So far, looks okay and this is with water at 57F. I expect the pox to come back but it doesn't seem fatal. I've read conflicting info re whether it's contagious (this is my belief). There's still probably 5 or so that also have some form of the pox, some more, some less. I'm hoping the water warms early next spring and it all goes away, but we'll see.

Now, there were a couple more that had ulcers/wounds. From what, I'm not sure. One hasn't changed (my ochiba sigure), another has seen it's bruise get smaller (my gin matsuba), and two others are in a holding pattern too. I've not seen either the turtles or other fish go after the koi and these 'ulcers/wounds' seem to only be on the koi; it might be from spawning behavior but I didn't see any evidence (among the koi) this year, and I look via the pondcam all the time.

So in a nutshell; no more losses, koi pox looks to be here to stay with it receding when the water warms, and those with ulcer/wounds will be entering winter that way. Guess I'll see when spring arrives as to if any of this cost any fish lives.

You did your best and hope they all survive. Too bad this happened as now some fish will have those darn lumps to look at. Lets hope that's all that happens tho.

[brokensword]

Just wondering how your koi are doing Brokensword?

well, I quarantined a fish with the pox, raised the temp up past 70, and it all went away in a week. So, the research was correct. Since the weather got warm again, I figured I'd put it back in the pond for the winter and monitor. So far, looks okay and this is with water at 57F. I expect the pox to come back but it doesn't seem fatal. I've read conflicting info re whether it's contagious (this is my belief). There's still probably 5 or so that also have some form of the pox, some more, some less. I'm hoping the water warms early next spring and it all goes away, but we'll see.

Now, there were a couple more that had ulcers/wounds. From what, I'm not sure. One hasn't changed (my ochiba sigure), another has seen it's bruise get smaller (my gin matsuba), and two others are in a holding pattern too. I've not seen either the turtles or other fish go after the koi and these 'ulcers/wounds' seem to only be on the koi; it might be from spawning behavior but I didn't see any evidence (among the koi) this year, and I look via the pondcam all the time.

So in a nutshell; no more losses, koi pox looks to be here to stay with it receding when the water warms, and those with ulcer/wounds will be entering winter that way. Guess I'll see when spring arrives as to if any of this cost any fish lives.

You did your best and hope they all survive. Too bad this happened as now some fish will have those darn lumps to look at. Lets hope that's all that happens tho.

yeah, kinda too bad as I fear this will eventually affect all of them, but still learning. We'll see what spring brings, I guess! Thanks for the concern!

[j.w]

well, I quarantined a fish with the pox, raised the temp up past 70, and it all went away in a week. So, the research was correct. Since the weather got warm again, I figured I'd put it back in the pond for the winter and monitor. So far, looks okay and this is with water at 57F. I expect the pox to come back but it doesn't seem fatal. I've read conflicting info re whether it's contagious (this is my belief). There's still probably 5 or so that also have some form of the pox, some more, some less. I'm hoping the water warms early next spring and it all goes away, but we'll see.

Now, there were a couple more that had ulcers/wounds. From what, I'm not sure. One hasn't changed (my ochiba sigure), another has seen it's bruise get smaller (my gin matsuba), and two others are in a holding pattern too. I've not seen either the turtles or other fish go after the koi and these 'ulcers/wounds' seem to only be on the koi; it might be from spawning behavior but I didn't see any evidence (among the koi) this year, and I look via the pondcam all the time.

So in a nutshell; no more losses, koi pox looks to be here to stay with it receding when the water warms, and those with ulcer/wounds will be entering winter that way. Guess I'll see when spring arrives as to if any of this cost any fish lives.

You did your best and hope they all survive. Too bad this happened as now some fish will have those darn lumps to look at. Lets hope that's all that happens tho.

yeah, kinda too bad as I fear this will eventually affect all of them, but still learning. We'll see what spring brings, I guess! Thanks for the concern!

Too sad for them and you. Maybe they will heal somehow. Do you think it prolly was from the new fish? Where else can it come from? Can't just happen out of the blue can it? Has to have been caught from another fish I would think and then passed on to more.

[brokensword]

You did your best and hope they all survive. Too bad this happened as now some fish will have those darn lumps to look at. Lets hope that's all that happens tho.

yeah, kinda too bad as I fear this will eventually affect all of them, but still learning. We'll see what spring brings, I guess! Thanks for the concern!

Too sad for them and you. Maybe they will heal somehow. Do you think it prolly was from the new fish? Where else can it come from? Can't just happen out of the blue can it? Has to have been caught from another fish I would think and then passed on to more.

yes, undoubtedly from one of the new fish. Researching this, it can lay dormant until some condition triggers it. For sure, none of the fish showed this upon arriving. They mention this is more typical in young fish, some mention that mature ones outgrow (I can only hope) and usually, koi pox does not kill them. There's 3 kinds of this koi herpes virus with one being fairly benign and the other two are killers. Pretty sure this is the first one as the pics I found online match what I see in my pics, and the warmer water did make the pox subside. I've been looking via the UW cam at the one I quarantined and so far, I don't see a recurrence despite the water is at 55F. Since there's nothing I can do about it, I'm going to just sit back and watch. It DOES put a damper on me getting any new koi, though, which may be a blessing in disguise!

[SarahT]

I don't recall [from] where you got the koi? If it was a dealer, perhaps let them know.
I've got my fingers crossed that the fish live happy and long lives, even if they have a couple of lumps.

[brokensword]

I don't recall [from] where you got the koi? If it was a dealer, perhaps let them know.
I've got my fingers crossed that the fish live happy and long lives, even if they have a couple of lumps.

I got all but 3 from BestKoiDirect (ebay online auctions); the 3 came from another auction dealer, NextDayKoi, which is the one I'm suspecting as I hadn't any evidence of koi pox from the others (which I've had for 4 years now). Hard to say, though, as from what I read, they don't always manifest until something triggers it. I thought, and still suspect, my water params were off and that's what did it, though the fish and water have always looked very good to my eye. I tested once late summer when the first fish (wound/ulcer) died and the ammonia was zero (or barely above), and with all the plants, figured nitrates were under control. Didn't have a nitrite test at the time (I do now) but don't think that was it. Early in the spring, I placed diy tubes of soluble iron in the bog for the plants (they looked like they had iron deficiency due to dark veins, light green leaves) and that proved disastrous as it all diluted immediately instead of 'over time'. Hence why I had 'red' water early spring. THIS is what I first suspected was causing the ulcers, though I had no real proof; the research said it could harm the fish long term as in organ issues. So, not sure the ulcer/wounds were from that, but definitely blamed myself initially.

Anyway, I thought about asking/alerting both ebay vendors but figured they'd just see it as a negative claim against and just deny/ignore the spirit of the ask. I'm pretty sure if their fish are at issue, others would already have complained (and maybe they have, but both dealers are still going strong, so I'm figuring this isn't something that occurs 'there' but after the fish experience the stress/cold temps -- their fish are housed inside in NC -- so doubt their water ever gets that cold to trigger anything).

Appreciate the concern!

[j.w]

yeah, kinda too bad as I fear this will eventually affect all of them, but still learning. We'll see what spring brings, I guess! Thanks for the concern!

Too sad for them and you. Maybe they will heal somehow. Do you think it prolly was from the new fish? Where else can it come from? Can't just happen out of the blue can it? Has to have been caught from another fish I would think and then passed on to more.

yes, undoubtedly from one of the new fish. Researching this, it can lay dormant until some condition triggers it. For sure, none of the fish showed this upon arriving. They mention this is more typical in young fish, some mention that mature ones outgrow (I can only hope) and usually, koi pox does not kill them. There's 3 kinds of this koi herpes virus with one being fairly benign and the other two are killers. Pretty sure this is the first one as the pics I found online match what I see in my pics, and the warmer water did make the pox subside. I've been looking via the UW cam at the one I quarantined and so far, I don't see a recurrence despite the water is at 55F. Since there's nothing I can do about it, I'm going to just sit back and watch. It DOES put a damper on me getting any new koi, though, which may be a blessing in disguise!

Me too hoping they only have the kind that won't kill them and possible will go away. You have so many beautiful fish now so yep think you have enough

[rubyduby]

Good to hear it goes away (or at least becomes dormant) when the water warms up...It is also great to hear that it will not kill the fish...I agree that it is futile to contact the vendors who will just say that the fish left their facility in great shape and that they have never heard any other complaints....yada yada yada....

[cas]

Years ago I had a goldfish with bumps all over its body that I assume was pox. No other fish got the bumps. The fish always made it through the winter. Unfortunately, the heron got it one year. But, fortunately, that was the only fish the heron got.

[brokensword]

Years ago I had a goldfish with bumps all over its body that I assume was pox. No other fish got the bumps. The fish always made it through the winter. Unfortunately, the heron got it one year. But, fortunately, that was the only fish the heron got.

those bumps are more likely tumors; before I expanded, some of my gf got them too (still have them). I don't believe gf get koi pox. It seems the tumors can be lived with also, though, when I tend to lose a gf over winter, it's the ones with tumors. It's a sure sign the water conditions went over the equilibrium line at least once! It was one of my lessons and along with losing one of my first koi (over winter), pushed me into the expansion. Since I only bought koi from two ebay vendors, one being 95% of my stock, I'm pretty sure where it came from. Thing is, none of the fish exhibited this until after they'd been in the pond half a year. I'm assuming water conditions triggered it. Obviously with a closed system, it's not like it got in the pond externally. I've accepted that all the koi will eventually get it but hope most of the summer, the water is warm enough and the fish strong enough to not affect their lives fatally. We'll see. I'm on a koi moratorium for the moment until I see exactly how this goes. Not every koi has it, I'd say maybe 8 right now. The one I took inside to confirm (with warmer water) died a week or so after I re-introduced it to the pond, but that might have been from me taking it in then putting it back out as the pox did indeed go away with 70F temps.

I'm glad you only lost the one, though! At least that's one aspect of losing fish I don't have to worry about! Just the things I do, apparently! Nice to see you again, cas!